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#141 theminimumcircus

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 09:28 AM

Exactly, that post by le chaton is retarded. Take it up with god if you're un happy with the mechanics of procreation. Good grief.


Shut up you Irish piece of shit. Your people should wiped off the map.
Wtf @ theminimuncircus retardly interjecting.

#142 le chaton

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 09:39 AM

glad to see we've returned to civilized debate at the SOMB.

#143 theminimumcircus

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 09:42 AM

glad to see we've returned to civilized debate at the SOMB.


He's a twat. Seriously, does that position deserve anything but scorn and utter dismissal?
Wtf @ theminimuncircus retardly interjecting.

#144 James D

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 09:53 AM

What? I believe women have a choice when they originally decide to fuck the guy. There are women that get pregnant who aren't rape victims y'know?

Exactly, that post by le chaton is retarded. Take it up with god if you're un happy with the mechanics of procreation. Good grief.

you're missing my point, smartass.

it's not that women didn't have a choice before getting pregnant, my point is that i think everyone can agree (pro-choice or pro-life) that it's shit to have to have an abortion (even pro-choicers aren't "pro-abortion," with rare exception), and as a society there's a lot more we could be doing to prevent unwanted pregnancy.

compared to the UK (and speaking from experience), US accessibility to sexual education and birth control is appalling. i grew up in the (then) most conservative county in IL and my friends routinely experienced difficulty (and disparaging remarks from health care professionals, if not outright verbal abuse) trying to get bc.


And look how that has helped us. In the UK, we have some of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe which of course leads to plenty of abortions as well.


Exactly, that post by le chaton is retarded. Take it up with god if you're un happy with the mechanics of procreation. Good grief.


Shut up you Irish piece of shit. Your people should wiped off the map.


Wtf @ theminimuncircus retardly interjecting



#145 theminimumcircus

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 10:08 AM

What? I believe women have a choice when they originally decide to fuck the guy. There are women that get pregnant who aren't rape victims y'know?

Exactly, that post by le chaton is retarded. Take it up with god if you're un happy with the mechanics of procreation. Good grief.

you're missing my point, smartass.

it's not that women didn't have a choice before getting pregnant, my point is that i think everyone can agree (pro-choice or pro-life) that it's shit to have to have an abortion (even pro-choicers aren't "pro-abortion," with rare exception), and as a society there's a lot more we could be doing to prevent unwanted pregnancy.

compared to the UK (and speaking from experience), US accessibility to sexual education and birth control is appalling. i grew up in the (then) most conservative county in IL and my friends routinely experienced difficulty (and disparaging remarks from health care professionals, if not outright verbal abuse) trying to get bc.


And look how that has helped us. In the UK, we have some of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe which of course leads to plenty of abortions as well.


So your answer to that is: abstinence. Or no, let's put a finer point on it: young women and girls should be responsible so that pregnancies don't occur. But if something were to go wrong--say, a prophylactic proves ineffective--the young woman's in the wrong. That's your argument. "Be more careful" is your fucking solution. No wonder Northern Ireland is literally hell on earth. You people deserve every last horrible thing that happens to you.
Wtf @ theminimuncircus retardly interjecting.

#146 le chaton

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 10:47 AM

And look how that has helped us. In the UK, we have some of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in Europe which of course leads to plenty of abortions as well.


Abortion Rates in Western Industrialized Countries

Country Rate per 1,000
United States 21.3
Australia 22.2
Sweden 18.7
Denmark 16.5
Canada 16.4
England & Wales 15.6
Germany 7.6
Holland 6.5


Posted Image

US is substantially higher than the UK. And for why the UK is higher than many other european nations:

BMJ

More teenage girls in the United States and United Kingdom become pregnant than anywhere else in the developed world, because they are poorly prepared for life in a modern and sexualised society, says a report out this week.

The United States has topped a table of teenage pregnancy rates put together by Unicef's Innocenti Research Centre in Italy, which looked at births among teenagers in 28 of the world's wealthiest nations.

Altogether, 52 out of every 1000 girls aged between 15 and 19 in the United States gave birth, while the United Kingdom topped the list in Europe—and came second overall—with just over 30 births in 1000 teenagers. At the other end of the scale Korea, Japan, Switzerland, the Netherlands, and Sweden had a rate of less than seven births per 1000 teenagers.

The researchers estimated that in the next 12 months at least 1.25 million teenagers in the world's wealthiest countries will become pregnant and three quarters of a million will become mothers. And, according to specially commissioned research from the University of Essex, teenagers who keep their baby are twice as likely to end up living in poverty than those who delay motherhood.

The eightfold difference in birth rates can be partly explained, the report says, by the move away from traditional family values in some countries to what the researchers call a “socio-sexual transformation” where sexual imagery permeates all aspects of life and teenagers are under greater pressure to experiment with sex. But the report adds that equally important is how these countries prepare their young people to cope with modern life.

Some countries, such as Sweden, the Netherlands, Denmark, Finland, and France, have “travelled far down the road from traditional values”, but they have also made “successful efforts to prepare their young people to cope with a more sexualised society.”

By comparison the United States and the United Kingdom are secretive and embarrassed about contraceptive services. After interviewing young people about sexual services, the UK government's Social Exclusion Unit concluded: “The universal message received from young people is that the sex and relationship education they receive falls far short of what they would like to equip them for managing relations as they grow into adulthood.”


By tackling teenage births governments have the chance to reduce poverty and its “perpetuation from one generation to the next”, says the report.


My point remains: the UK is better than the US, and the way to make improvements in both countries is INCREASED education and INCREASED access.

#147 bleach

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 12:58 PM

everything is alive. that is why its a matter of guilt. do you (anyone, pro-life/pro-choice) feel guilty when you squash a spider?

pro-choice and yes.
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#148 6ome 9irl

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 02:24 PM

i'm saving myself for luke perry. :wub:

#149 Petition

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 08:51 PM

Since this is a woman's pleasure or "problem", carrying and caring for an infant for at the very least, 18 years, this surely is is an issue for a woman and her doctor/significant other. Nothing else matters and nothing that that any government agency needs belongs in the equation. "Pro-Lifer's" would do well to remember the days of the coat hangers, hemorrhage, gas gangrene, and certain death of those desperate women before safe and legal abortions were available to women of every socioeconomic strata. :angry:
"Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, try to love one another right now....right now....Jesse Colin Young (Youngbloods). "Sugar, Sugar, honey, honey....you are my candygirl and you got me wantin' you.....*

#150 le chaton

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 08:02 AM

just want to add to this, i work with two women who are doubly-incontinent from childbirth. anyone who claims it is not a massive body-changing experience for a woman, keep that in mind (someone upthread mentioned women being selfish for not wanting to harm their figures).

#151 ryan

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Posted 09 October 2008 - 01:32 PM

bump

#152 Petition

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Posted 09 October 2008 - 01:48 PM

This is a decision between a woman and her doctor. Not religion, not government, not public opinion. Let us not bring back the days of coathangers, gas gangrene, exsanguination, hemorrhage and certain death to many a desperate women. If the women are rich will have a safe abortion say, in Puerto Rico, and the poor will die in alone in filthy circumstances because they could not afford anything better than the gutter.
"Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, try to love one another right now....right now....Jesse Colin Young (Youngbloods). "Sugar, Sugar, honey, honey....you are my candygirl and you got me wantin' you.....*