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faraway
QUOTE (theremin @ Jan 22 2009, 04:39 PM) *
QUOTE (nagode @ Jan 22 2009, 03:16 PM) *
because sun and jin cant see dead people...also the whole thing with finding the dead pig on the island makes me think hes been there before


Dude. Miles can hear dead people talk, he just went looking for the voice of the boar. That's how he knew how long it had been dead also.


So I guess the Boar spoke English?
theremin
QUOTE (farawaysoclose @ Jan 22 2009, 04:53 PM) *
QUOTE (theremin @ Jan 22 2009, 04:39 PM) *
QUOTE (nagode @ Jan 22 2009, 03:16 PM) *
because sun and jin cant see dead people...also the whole thing with finding the dead pig on the island makes me think hes been there before


Dude. Miles can hear dead people talk, he just went looking for the voice of the boar. That's how he knew how long it had been dead also.


So I guess the Boar spoke English?


I can't remember what was up with Miles, I think he can only hear people in normal circumstances for a certain amount of time. That one time he wanted to talk to someone that died, he asked how long they had been dead. I think the ghost he got rid of was therefore an abnormal situation.

I think his exact words about the boar were "he's been dead for, definitely less than 3 hours", or whatever.


kingsleadhat
QUOTE (TJENZ @ Jan 22 2009, 03:36 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 03:14 PM) *
Random side question that came to mind while watching the recap show: What happened to all the crash survivors who were abducted by the Others? Like the children and flight attendant? Are they still with the Others?

We have seen one of the flight attendants with the Others, as recently as the end of season four.



QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

And I interpreted Miles' 3-hour comment as "don't worry, the meat hasn't rotted yet".
kingsleadhat
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.
pong
Oh yeah: the Miles boar thing.

Are the dudes who fired the arrows the same dudes who were going to chop off Juliet's hand? I am not 100% convinced of that.
pong
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.


The people who shift are simply people that are not indigenous to the island?
Tracy Jacks
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 10:26 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.


The people who shift are simply people that are not indigenous to the island?

What about the hot redheaded chick freighter chick who Faraday loves that I remember by her vacant but sexy expressions from Devil Wears Prada? Hasn't it been suggested that she has returned to the island, implying she is indigenous? Is that why she is bleeding from her nose? How does her hotness figure into things?
faraway
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 10:26 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.


The people who shift are simply people that are not indigenous to the island?


This is what I thought, but where does that leave Cindy, the kids, and possibly-not-dead Jin and Claire?

They also hinted Charlotte is indigenous to the island, but she's shifting with the rest of them.
Angrimorfee
QUOTE (theremin @ Jan 22 2009, 05:39 PM) *
QUOTE (nagode @ Jan 22 2009, 03:16 PM) *
because sun and jin cant see dead people...also the whole thing with finding the dead pig on the island makes me think hes been there before


Dude. Miles can hear dead people talk, he just went looking for the voice of the boar. That's how he knew how long it had been dead also.


Oh please. You don't mean that literally, do you? Let's say he has a talent for scoping out the deceased (shit, that sounds so Heroes...)
biggie mcsmalls
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting?



She is still alive.

She has not freed herself from space and time?

Edit: I also am not sure about Cindy and the kids. Do we even know where they are? Were they in the group assembled with Locke and Richard, or were they part of the group that was sent to the Ruins?

LOL, LOST.
biggie mcsmalls
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 10:24 PM) *
Are the dudes who fired the arrows the same dudes who were going to chop off Juliet's hand? I am not 100% convinced of that.



I don't think so.

I think the people with the flaming arrows will turn out to be the "hostiles" that we've heard about.
Angrimorfee
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 23 2009, 09:38 AM) *
I think the people with the flaming arrows will turn out to be the "hostiles" that we've heard about.

FTR, the clip show identified "the Others" as also "the Hostiles".
biggie mcsmalls
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 23 2009, 08:39 AM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 23 2009, 09:38 AM) *
I think the people with the flaming arrows will turn out to be the "hostiles" that we've heard about.

FTR, the clip show identified "the Others" as also "the Hostiles".


Ah, I did not see that.
pong
I have always held out that the show is subtly hinting at a "third party", but I have nothing to back that up. laugh.gif
faraway
There's also Rousseau's team, whoever came over on the Black Rock, the real Henry Gale.
Bob Loblaw
QUOTE (Tracy Jacks @ Jan 23 2009, 12:13 AM) *
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 10:26 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.


The people who shift are simply people that are not indigenous to the island?

What about the hot redheaded chick freighter chick who Faraday loves that I remember by her vacant but sexy expressions from Devil Wears Prada? Hasn't it been suggested that she has returned to the island, implying she is indigenous? Is that why she is bleeding from her nose? How does her hotness figure into things?



Did you find Rocky Dennis attractive?

pong
QUOTE (Tracy Jacks @ Jan 22 2009, 11:13 PM) *
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 10:26 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 09:24 PM) *
QUOTE (cerebralcaustic @ Jan 22 2009, 05:57 PM) *
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 22 2009, 03:42 PM) *
She had some of the children with her, as well.

So what happened to them when the island shifted? Since they were survivors of the crash, wouldn't they be in the same state as Locke, Sawyer, et al? This is suddenly a huge question.

Gah, thinking about this some more, why is Juliet time-shifting? It seems completely arbitrary who time-shifted and who didn't. It's clearly not based on if someone is native to the island (otherwise the flight attendant would have shifted), nor is it based on if someone is "special" and indoctrinated somehow with the Others (otherwise Juliet and/or Locke wouldn't have shifted). This feels like the type of thing that wasn't really well thought-out, nor does it seem like a Really Big Question that the writers are going to bother with.


The people who shift are simply people that are not indigenous to the island?

What about the hot redheaded chick freighter chick who Faraday loves that I remember by her vacant but sexy expressions from Devil Wears Prada? Hasn't it been suggested that she has returned to the island, implying she is indigenous? Is that why she is bleeding from her nose? How does her hotness figure into things?


I like the way you think.
pong
By Jeff Jensen

And down the rabbit hole we go. Or should that be wormhole? Lost plunged into brain-boggling sci-fi in last night's premiere, and the show itself seemed anxious about our reaction. The self-conscious opening sequence — with Dharma laborers drilling into the Island's ''exotic matter'' and melting their bits; the Dharma hardhat who rolled his eyes at the Dharma Dude of Many Names as he bleated about time travel — spoke to and for those who have always worried that the show's overtly out-there elements would turn the series into silly hokum. If you got a cathartic thrill out of seeing Sawyer slap Doc Faraday across his scruffy theory-spouting mug (ouch!) and then threaten scientist sidekick Charlotte Lewis with the same (''Shut it, Ginger, or you're getting one, too!''), then you're probably one of the wary. Me? I've always liked Lost's geeky side, and more, the adventurous storytelling it inspires. ''Because You Left'' — which skipped back and forth along the Island's timeline, leaving the castaways (and us) to puzzle out their time/space whereabouts — was a wild winner in my book. And it was made possible, no doubt, by all the bandwagon fans that have fallen off over the years — the ones Lost doesn't have to worry about alienating anymore. ''Because You Left.'' How ironic.

Still, for all its risky choices, the premiere did what all Lost premieres aspire to do: activate a wide swath of story in deft, dynamic fashion and remind us just who these characters are. Jack the reluctant hero. Kate the lonely fugitive. Hurley the cursed clown. Shirtless Sawyer, the abandonment-forged rogue, distraught over departed and dead friends, best expressed the episode's tenor of heartbreak and disorientation. He also best embodied its nervous subtext. The producers have joked that leaving Sawyer half naked for the whole episode was meant to pleasure those for whom the genre stuff might be displeasing. Yet he also stands for a show that took the risk of exposing a big part of itself to the audience — a part that it has often had to keep hidden for fear of being rejected.

The episode made clever use of a Willie Nelson tune called ''Shotgun Willie.'' (More on this in a minute.) But I found myself humming Nelson's more iconic hits, ''Always On My Mind'' and ''On The Road Again,'' as ''Because You Left'' went about its business of reintroducing our haunted, Constant-deprived heroes and then putting them in perilous transit. Two notes about what you're about to read. (1) Out of respect to those who may have only watched the premiere, this piece contains no spoilers of ''The Lie,'' which I'm giving its own recap. (2) This recap is very, very long. Much longer than I intended, much longer than it should be. My apologies. But let the length be proof of how much ''Because You Left'' engaged me — and I promise to be more concise, beginning with my take on ''The Lie.''

Ding dong, the beard is gone! Yet things remain pretty hairy for Jack on the inside. Like some clean-shaven Samson, Doc Shepherd was rendered a blind, impotent shell of his former self. His vaunted rationality — his eyes; his strength — has been proven meaningless in the face of Island magic and the inescapable fate worshipped by ideological nemesis, John Locke. (''What did he say to make you such a believer?'' Ben asked, believer landing like a snarky slap.) Now, he must trust another enemy to help him round up the rest of the Oceanic 6 and find an Island that currently doesn't want to be found. Ben not only appointed himself Jack's Island-tracking kemosabe, but as he revealed in the season's second episode, his Narconon sponsor, too. The exiled Other flushed the pills down the crapper and bought him a dapper new suit. If this manipulative mastermind thing doesn't work out, Ben should really consider a makeover show on Bravo.

JACK AND BEN

Did you notice how Jack's story was basically rebooted? Season 1: Mom scolded Jack to duty, pushed his guilt buttons to save his father from a deadly Down Under bender. Season 5: Ben needles Jack to heroism, pushing his buttons to rescue his friends from their super-string reality-bender. To borrow from the giant on Twin Peaks: ''It is happening again.'' Or, to paraphrase Nietzsche: Eternal recurrence, baby! (Or, in your words: STOP IT.)

I know many of you don't like Jack, but I do. I find his jittery ruin relevant and his redemption yearning poignant. Bemoaning his god-awful life, Jack moaned: ''How did this happen?'' Ben snapped: ''It happened because you left.'' Two interpretations. (1) Sarcasm. Ben's basically saying: You know, if you stayed on the Island, things would be different, because… well, things would be different. (2) Something more cosmic. Ben's matter-of-fact declaration — combined with Richard Alpert telling John Locke that to save the Island, he had to bring the Oceanic 6 back — made me question: What really caused the Island to vanish? Was it the frozen donkey wheel — or was it actually the Oceanic 6? Could it be that the very act of leaving so disrupted the predestined flow of history that it knocked the Island offline? And can you explain to me what I just said?

More ambiguous line readings open to multiple interpretations: Ben asked Jack if Locke had spelled out exactly what had gone down on the Island after they left. Jack: Nope. Ben: ''Well, I guess we'll never know.'' Do you think the Machiavellian maestro is truly that clueless — or do you think he knows stuff and it serves his interest to make Jack think he doesn't? Think this through. The premiere gave us the answer to Ben's probing inquiry: After Jack and co. bailed, the remaining castaways started ricocheting through time. The opening sequence, in fact, revealed that at least Faraday is destined to make a stop in the mid-seventies Dharma Initiative past — perhaps right about the time Ben and his widowed father arrived on the Island. If this is where/when the season is going — if the rest of the time traveling castaways will be joining Faraday in the Dharma heyday — the implication is clear: Ben has probably known the castaways — or known about them — since he was a kid!

And what about this possibility: What if Jack's bluffing, too? What if Locke did tell him stuff, but Jack is playing dumb? It wouldn't be the first time; see: The Kidney Sack Bait-And-Switch; and The ''I Got A Plan To Kill The Others And I Ain't Tellin' Anyone'' Gambit from Season 3.

SUN AND WIDMORE

The Season 4 finale introduced us to a new Sun, all Lady Vengeance, as she confronted Charles Widmore on a London street with knowledge of his badassery — and the offer of an alliance. The power plays continued in the premiere. En route to L.A., Sun was pulled out of the airport queue and tossed into a security holding room. This time, Widmore had waylaid her: Penelope's Island-hunting father (he's been searching for 20 years — a conspicuous detail dropped by Miles Straume) wanted to accept her offer...and establish control in the relationship. And once again, Sun is the subordinate spouse, forced to walk behind her male mate. But is she hatching another betrayal? And another burning question that stems from the fact that Sun told Widmore she wants Ben dead. But do you believe her? Sure, Ben is a bad man. But was he responsible for Jin's death? No. That was Keamy the Merc whose bomb blew up the freighter. Which belonged to Widmore. Who wanted everyone on the Island dead. It should be Chuck's blue blood that Sun should want spilled. Maybe she's playing double agent, pretending to be a Ben Hater but really a Ben Friend tasked with spying on their mutual enemy. Maybe she's just getting close enough to shiv him when he's not looking. Those would be the simplest answers, though they hinge on the assumption that Sun is all about Jin grief. But what if she isn't? What if Sun has moved on? What if Sun has a new man, a man worthy of her station, possessed of money and power, a man whom Ben would want dead because he threatened his need to get all of the Oceanic 6 back to the Island? My friends: What if Sun is knocking boots with ''The Economist'' — the never-seen money man that Ben wanted Sayid to assassinate last season? What if Sun is trying to bump off Ben to protect her new life, not avenge her old one?

HURLEY AND SAYID

The safe house was not so safe. Having busted Hurley out of the loony bin, Sayid hooked up Food Addict's Bitch with some fast food burgers from Rainbow Diner (Mr. Cluck's must still be shuttered for repairs; meteorite damage, you know) and brought him to his apartment. ''You know, maybe if you ate more comfort food you wouldn't have to go around shooting people,'' Hurley told Sayid, whose unrepentant attitude after killing out of sheer paranoia was truly disconcerting. Motivated by a danger-detecting Spidey sense that's been on mega-tingle since the dubious death of Jeremy Bentham, a.k.a. 'He Who Shall Not Be Openly Referred To As John Locke,' the once-a-soldier, always-a-soldier Iraqi spoke of a falling-out with Ben, for whom he had been doing the flash-forward assassin thing, and implored Hurley not to trust Mr. McShifty. (Clearly, a flashback for a forthcoming episode.) At the safe house: ambush. Sayid got the best of his shadowy enemies — he tossed one off the balcony and impaled another on some dirty cutlery — but not before getting shot with a tranquilizer dart. Hurley was caught on phone-cam with the bad guy's gun in his hand and incriminating blood-red ketchup on his shirt: Oops. ''I never should have left the Island!'' he cried, carting his snoozing bodyguard to the car. On the run, nowhere to go, madness encroaching, no grease bomb to comfort him. The Curse, renewed. (More on Hurley in my recap of ''The Lie.'')

KATE AND AARON

The safety and security of their fraudulent post-Island lives officially imploded with the arrival of lawyers employed by a mystery client demanding genetic proof that Claire's kid was Kate's son. Busted! So Kate did what Kate does best: She ran. The conspicuous dote on the framed picture of Jack reminded us that Kate's heart is in flux. But after last year's smooch and whisper with Sawyer in the chopper — one of the most genuinely romantic moments in a show that has often struggled to generate credible love story drama — I can't imagine her really winding up with Jack. Can you? Debate. BTW: ''Dan Norton,'' ''Agostini,'' ''Goober'' — I unpacked them in yesterday's Doc Jensen column. Moving on.

JOHN LOCKE AND THE QUEST OF THE LOST DESTINY

When we last left the Man of Faith, Ben had anointed him the new leader of the Others. But his inauguration was rudely interrupted by time warp fluctuations. Locke and the Left Behinders first landed on the day the drug plane arrived — the one that brought Mr. Eko's brother and all those smack-stuffed Virgin Mary idols. (According to Lostpedia.org, this event occurred in the late 1990s.) Then, after getting shot in the leg by Tom Cruise's Cousin (i.e., Ethan the Other) with what appeared to be an old, WWII-era gun, Locke zipped forward in time to a point in Island history after Boone's death; we know this, because the drug plane was no longer in the trees and The Hatch was cratered. (It's possible that Locke had traveled to a point wayyy in the future of our story: when he was met by Richard Alpert, the ageless Other knew the Oceanic 6 had successfully made it back to civilization and that bringing them back would save the Island.) Alpert tended to Locke's gunshot wound and gave him an old compass — the same compass that Alpert used in his testing of Young Locke in last year's episode ''Cabin Fever.'' Then, before he swooshed away in another Scott Bakula hot flash — this time backward in time, to the early 2000s and the Desmond era of The Hatch — Alpert told Locke that to become the savior that the Island needs him to be…Baldie must die!

Loved the buzz-kill irony. Loved the crazy-deflating deadpan humor. (LOCKE: ''What is that?'' ALPERT: ''It's a compass.'' LOCKE: ''What does it do?'' ALPERT: ''It…points north, John.'') And yes, the Jesus/sacrificial lamb/resurrection foreshadowing is irresistible. For now, let us note that like many of the other characters, Locke looped back to his Lost beginnings, a maimed man crashed to earth who has an encounter with Island magic that puts him on a hero's journey and requires a major leap of faith. It is happening again. Maybe here, in the Island's past, Locke and co. will find the resolution and fulfillment they couldn't get in the Island's present.

DANIEL FARADAY AND THE ALLEGORY OF THE BROKEN RECORD

And now we know why Lost decided to put a guy on the Island with time travel expertise. Mr. Explain-It-All likened the castaways' quantum leaping to a skipping record, and the image I got was a dislodged record needle bouncing across vinyl, trying to find a new groove to settle into. That certainly fits the episode we saw, wherein the Island and/or the castaways moved erratically through history. But Lost gave us another example of a skipping record that was a little different: Dr. Pierre Chang's stuck-in-a-rut ''Shotgun Willie'' album. Over and over, we heard the refrain:

''You can't make a record.''

If this, too, was a time-travel analogy, it more accurately describes a different form than the one modeled by the episode's narrative. ''Shotgun Willie'' better exemplified the whole time loop thing, where one experiences the same events over again, à la Bill Murray in Groundhog Day or Desmond in ''Flashes Before Your Eyes.'' I wonder if this is where Lost is headed once the skipping stops and a groove is found: a twisty time loop tale, in which we witness the castaways in the past helping to generate the Island history that sets the stage for their future drama. Faraday's presence in the Dharma Initiative '70s suggests as much. Or maybe we'll see the castaways brought back to point when Oceanic 815 crashed and experience anew their whole saga.

Can the past be changed? Faraday said ''Nope.'' Apparently, Fate has rules. Lots of them, and not all of them were spelled out, so many questions we may have about time travel on Lost remain unanswered for now. For example: Can the castaways interact with their past selves? (Maybe this explains The Whispers: they belong to time traveling castaways observing their past selves, but forbidden by Fate from being seen or interfering.) But we were told and shown there are exceptions to the rules, given to those who are ''uniquely and miraculously special'' — and Desmond is one of those people. And because he is, Faraday was able to send Future Off-Island Desmond an SOS via Past On-Island Desmond. I initially thought ''Hey! Shouldn't Island Desmond remember Daniel Faraday?'' After all, in ''The Constant,'' we saw Pre-Island Desmond visit Pre-Island Daniel at Oxford. But that was an example of mental projection time travel, not physical time travel, and I'm guessing Lost adheres to the controversial perspective that memory resides not in the physical structure of the brain, but in the electrical currents of consciousness. Anyway, Faraday told Island Desmond to find his mother — and suddenly, 'Hiding Out From Charles Widmore on Penny's Boat In The Present' Desmond woke up recalling this Island event. That Desmond had no previous recollection of this really, really weird encounter — and you would think he would — leads me to draw this conclusion: the past CAN be changed, but probably not in anyway that creates catastrophic paradox. Bookmark this debate: Methinks Season 5 is all about this fluidity of time and mutability of history stuff.

Oh, and how much do you wanna bet that Daniel Faraday's Oxford-hanging mom is that lovely lady from Desmond's previous time travel jaunt, the one and only Ms. Hawking?


PIERRE CHANG…AND SHOTGUN WILLIE

The first line of season 5 was ''Baby's awake. Your turn.'' It was said to a character that has come to personify the show's sci-fi, puzzle-game aspects: Dr. Pierre Chang, a.k.a. The Dharma Dude of Many Names. Other fans might find it odd that the show would launch the season with this peripheral, polarizing player, but I wonder if a point was being made. Was this Lost 's way of saying that here, at this point in the Lost epic, nourishing the story with a big bottle of geek is exactly what the saga needs?

The subtextual messages continue with the Shotgun Willie record. Nelson's 1973 album is now recalled as an important achievement in his artistic development — but at the time, the people hated it. Says iTunes: ''Nelson's then new songs sound like they'd been around for decades, and the cover [songs] sound like they were his all along.…Naturally, [the album] failed miserably at the time, but its importance and influence continue to grow.''

''

Sounds like a time travel record. Sounds like a freak flag flown high. Sounds like what Season 5 aspires to be. Have you ever heard the title track, the one Dr. Chang listened to while feeding his baby? On the show, the tune starts skipping half a line into the refrain. The rest of it goes like this:

You can't make a record if you ain't got nothin' to say/ You can't play music if you don't know nothin' to play

Which reminds me of the song Lost used to open its second season, when it gulped hard and gave us the bizarre story of a man in a hatch that had to push a button every 108 minutes:

Make your own kind of music/Make your own special song

Make your own kind of music/Even if they won't sing along…

Translation: Yes, the producers do have a master plan. And now, it's time to play it out. Here's hoping it rocks.

+++ I've gone on and on — and there's so much we haven't discussed. Do you think Pierre Chang's baby is someone we know — maybe Miles Straume? And did you notice that both of Pierre Chang's arms were fine and functioning? (In the orientation film for The Hatch, it appeared his left arm was unmoving — a prosthetic.) When you saw all the Dharma people milling outside in everyday garb, and then saw the Dharma folks on the film set wearing Dharma jumpsuit, and then saw Chang pout like a petulant actor, did you find yourself wondering: How much of The Dharma Initiative was legit and how much of it was total theater? So much to talk about. And now it's time for YOU to talk about it.

Lost is back. Let the crazy begin.
Angrimorfee
wowsers.
faraway
I'm not going to post these full articles, but I suggest reading these. The second one is especially tantalizing.

MythBuster Adam Savage on Lost Premiere: James Cameron's Time Travel has Nothing on Lost

Lost Season Five Premiere: 2 Hours of Time Travel, Wormholes and Exotic Matter
Angrimorfee
Uh oh. Half-joking here.... "Slaughterhouse 5"..."Oceanic 6"...which one will become a Billy Pilgrim and might not survive after all is said and done?
WesterMats
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 23 2009, 03:47 PM) *
Uh oh. Half-joking here.... "Slaughterhouse 5"..."Oceanic 6"...which one will become a Billy Pilgrim and might not survive after all is said and done?

Considering that Billy Pilgrim had become unstuck in time? Desmond?
WesterMats
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 22 2009, 12:26 PM) *
Things I Noticed - "Because You Left and The Lie" by Vozzek69
Posted by DarkUFO at 10:37 (Comments: 29) Comment Pop-up
Labels: Because You Left, Recaps, The Lie, Vozzek69

the wanna-be Sawyer cameraman, whose haircut and facial hair offer us visual duplicity

In "Live Together, Die Alone," there was also a Jack-alike, who was a member of Penny's tracking team in the Antarctic.
theremin
but the oceanic 6 are the ones NOT bouncing around time.
pong
If there was a LOST porno rip off I'd watch it.
Angrimorfee
QUOTE (theremin @ Jan 24 2009, 05:13 PM) *
but the oceanic 6 are the ones NOT bouncing around time.

Yet.
faraway
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 22 2009, 01:32 PM) *
Hey, serious question...anyone think that we need to remember that Sawyer gouged his foot on something...will that become important later?


Yes. Sawyer will evenutally lose one of his toes because of the injury. He will then time travel to the ancient civilization on the island and they will think he is a god and make a statue of him. Thus, the four-toed statue.
pong
The Key to this season can be found in this wonderful movie:

Angrimorfee
QUOTE (pong @ Jan 26 2009, 02:30 PM) *
The Key to this season can be found in this wonderful movie:



For Red X haters, that would be Stargate.
Tracy Jacks
QUOTE (farawaysoclose @ Jan 26 2009, 01:27 PM) *
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 22 2009, 01:32 PM) *
Hey, serious question...anyone think that we need to remember that Sawyer gouged his foot on something...will that become important later?


Yes. Sawyer will evenutally lose one of his toes because of the injury. He will then time travel to the ancient civilization on the island and they will think he is a god and make a statue of him. Thus, the four-toed statue.

If Sawyer was the one who time travels to an ancient civilization, the statue would be a shirtless torso. And it would have a inscription that read "What are you staring at Ringo".
Kennan
QUOTE (Tracy Jacks @ Jan 26 2009, 04:10 PM) *
QUOTE (farawaysoclose @ Jan 26 2009, 01:27 PM) *
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 22 2009, 01:32 PM) *
Hey, serious question...anyone think that we need to remember that Sawyer gouged his foot on something...will that become important later?


Yes. Sawyer will evenutally lose one of his toes because of the injury. He will then time travel to the ancient civilization on the island and they will think he is a god and make a statue of him. Thus, the four-toed statue.

If Sawyer was the one who time travels to an ancient civilization, the statue would be a shirtless torso. And it would have a inscription that read "What are you staring at Ringo".


it's funny though, i don't see the above as such a far-out idea. i don't know if you guys watched the recap prior, but they did bring up the four-toed statue, leading me to believe that that is one of the mysteries they *will* resolve before show's end...
biggie mcsmalls


Four toed statue.

Coincidence? I doubt it.
tjenz
my current theory on Jakob's identity. Jakob is Jack.
Look who hangs out in Jake's cabin... Jack's dad and Jack's sister. It's family reunion time in the cabin.

Jack sacrifices himself, to save Kate. Kate & Sawyer live happily ever after. Jack becomes Jakob.
Adam & Eve = Penny & Desmond
Angrimorfee
QUOTE (TJENZ @ Jan 26 2009, 05:38 PM) *
my current theory on Jakob's identity. Jakob is Jack.
Look who hangs out in Jake's cabin... Jack's dad and Jack's sister. It's family reunion time in the cabin.

Jack sacrifices himself, to save Kate. Kate & Sawyer live happily ever after. Jack becomes Jakob.
Adam & Eve = Penny & Desmond


Holy sweet Jesus. Now, you realize of course Abrams, Lindelof & Cuse will now have to kill you. wink.gif
Angrimorfee
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 26 2009, 05:25 PM) *

Four toed statue.
Coincidence? I doubt it.


What was the Elmo's World topic of the day? laugh.gif
faraway
QUOTE (Agrimorfee @ Jan 26 2009, 03:57 PM) *
QUOTE (TJENZ @ Jan 26 2009, 05:38 PM) *
my current theory on Jakob's identity. Jakob is Jack.
Look who hangs out in Jake's cabin... Jack's dad and Jack's sister. It's family reunion time in the cabin.

Jack sacrifices himself, to save Kate. Kate & Sawyer live happily ever after. Jack becomes Jakob.
Adam & Eve = Penny & Desmond


Holy sweet Jesus. Now, you realize of course Abrams, Lindelof & Cuse will now have to kill you. wink.gif


Interesting theory, but I doubt it. So why would Jack make a list of people from Flight 815 to capture (as in Jacob's list)? Unless Ben is making all that list stuff up. But it seems like Ben really is taking orders from someone, like when he says, "I hope you're happy now Jacob" before pushing the donkey wheel.
tjenz
QUOTE (farawaysoclose @ Jan 26 2009, 04:34 PM) *
So why would Jack make a list of people from Flight 815 to capture (as in Jacob's list)?

because that is what is supposed to happen
Angrimorfee
And let's face it...nobody from the flight who landed on that island has made more mistakes that have affected more people than Jack...he would owe it to them to make things right.

The only wrinkle though is how the heck "Jacob" convinces Ben that "he" is the answer to everything?
faraway
That would make the mobisode where Jacob/Christian tells Vincent to go wake up Jack because he has "work to do" extra weird.
pong
TJENZ could be OTM.

I just can't wait to find out what Ben's been thinking all this time...
Angrimorfee
What also bothers me is that Lindelof & Cuse kept reminding us during the clip show that Ben "is an evil guy, " so he isn't doing anything benevolent...or is he?
faraway
The recap thing was for newcomers who wouldn't already know Ben is a bad guy, so I wouldn't worry about it too much. Even still, Ben has done some pretty evil stuff (killing father/Dharma people, having Walt tortured, the whole freighter blowing up thing, brainwashing Claire).
Angrimorfee
KATE DISCOVERS THAT SOMEONE KNOWS AARON’S
TRUE PARENTAL LINEAGE, ON ABC’S “LOST”


“The Little Prince” – Kate discovers that someone knows the secret of Aaron's true parental lineage. Meanwhile, the dramatic shifts through time are placing the lives of the remaining island survivors in extreme peril, on “Lost,” WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 11 (8:00-9:00 p.m., ET) on the ABC Television Network. (Rebroadcast. OAD 2/4/09)

“Lost” stars Naveen Andrews as Sayid, Henry Ian Cusick as Desmond, Jeremy Davies as Daniel Faraday, Michael Emerson as Ben, Matthew Fox as Jack, Jorge Garcia as Hurley, Josh Holloway as Sawyer, Yunjin Kim as Sun, Ken Leung as Miles, Evangeline Lilly as Kate, Elizabeth Mitchell as Juliet and Terry O’Quinn as Locke.

Guest starring are
Spoiler/NSFW: click to show/hide
Rebecca Mader as Charlotte Lewis, Susan Duerden as Carole Littleton, Tom Irwin as Dan Norton, William Blanchett as Aaron, Emerson Brooks as Tony, Stephanie Niznik as Dr. Evelyn Ariza, Melissa Farman as young Frenchwoman, Guillaume Dabinpons as Frenchman #1, Marc Menard as Frenchman #2, Bruno Bruni as Frenchman #3 and Ane Tranetzki as bellman.

“The Little Prince” was written by Brian K. Vaughan & Melinda Hsu Taylor and directed by Stephen Williams.

-- ABC --


January 26, 2009


LOCKE TAKES IT UPON HIMSELF TO PUT AN END TO THE ISLAND’S
VIOLENT SHIFTS THROUGH TIME, ON ABC’S “LOST”


“This Place is Death” – Locke takes on the burden to stop the island's increasingly violent shifts through time. Meanwhile, Ben hits a roadblock in his attempt to reunite the Oceanic 6 and bring them back to the island, on “Lost,” WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 11 (9:00-10:02 p.m., ET) on the ABC Television Network.

Note: This episode will repeat Feb. 18 from 8:00-9:00 p.m., ET.

“Lost” stars Naveen Andrews as Sayid, Henry Ian Cusick as Desmond, Jeremy Davies as Daniel Faraday, Michael Emerson as Ben, Matthew Fox as Jack, Jorge Garcia as Hurley, Josh Holloway as Sawyer, Yunjin Kim as Sun, Ken Leung as Miles, Evangeline Lilly as Kate, Elizabeth Mitchell as Juliet and Terry O’Quinn as Locke.

Guest starring are
Spoiler/NSFW: click to show/hide
Rebecca Mader as Charlotte Lewis, John Terry as Christian Shephard, Fionnula Flanagan as Eloise Hawking, William Blanchett as Aaron, June Kyoko Lu as Mrs. Paik, Melissa Farman as young Frenchwoman, Guillaume Dabinpons as Frenchman #1, Marc Menard as Frenchman #2, Bruno Bruni as Frenchman #3 and Jaymie Kim as Ji Yeon.

“This Place is Death” was written by Edward Kitsis & Adam Horowitz and directed by Paul Edwards.

tjenz
so the army guys that are going after the time shifting losties are really Others. Which begs the question, why are the Others running around dressed like army guys? and why are they shooting flaming arrows?



Angrimorfee
QUOTE (TJENZ @ Jan 27 2009, 12:00 PM) *
so the army guys that are going after the time shifting losties are really Others. Which begs the question, why are the Others running around dressed like army guys? and why are they shooting flaming arrows?


They
Spoiler/NSFW: click to show/hide
stole them from some other army detail that landed there. We don't know how many other groups have landed there
. Where did you get this info?
Spoiler/NSFW: click to show/hide
The most recently seen "army" groups could actually be just one of those other accidental landings
.

And flaming arrows are cooler to see during a night-time scene on TV than if they weren't on fire.

EDIT: How are you doing the black-out censoring method, which I highly prefer over the Insert code method?
tjenz
QUOTE (pong @ Aug 11 2008, 10:58 AM) *
QUOTE (TJENZ @ Jul 27 2008, 09:34 AM) *


Marvin Candle


TJENZ: what is that? And, it sounds like Faraday at the end of that saying "this is useless".

knowing what we now know, it is worth taking another look at this Pierre Chang video
Angrimorfee
Oh by the way, Desmond and Penny had a kid.

Even with heavy Des involvment, a transitionary ep with lots of characters running around not knowing what to do.
biggie mcsmalls
Interesting that Locke sent Richard to find him on his own b-day.

Angrimorfee
QUOTE (biggie mcsmalls @ Jan 29 2009, 10:21 AM) *
Interesting that Locke sent Richard to find him on his own b-day.


Which he did. ohmy.gif

TJENZ, I wondered why the hell you had posted "Jughead" up there... rolleyes.gif
Huckle
"Widmore? Charles Widmore?"

That was a good "ooh" moment for me and the wife.
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